Israel has other plans...

uncle alcoholuncle alcohol Posts: 159
edited 03/04/10 in Off Topic
The Palestinians of Gaza are the WEAKEST and most defenseless Arabs in the World within striking distance of the Israeli Army so of course the Israelis have chosen to erase their "Humiliating" defeat in Lebanon at the hands of Hezbollah by killing thousands of Palestinians on the FLIMSY fuckin excuse that unguided bottle rockets shot into Israel as resistance to Israeli Occupation justifies a "Shock and Awe" murderous response that will kill thousands of INNOCENT people. This is War Crimes, Nazis were hung for just such crimes against the Polish people. Sad and pathetic. Welcome to 2009 in the Middle East.


  • joolsmithjoolsmith Posts: 823
    edited 11/30/99
    I don't know how this will go down in the US, but there is a huge amount of sympathy for the Palestinians and anger towards the Israelis in the UK. There was a march on Downing Street at the weekend by thousands of people demanding international pressure on the Israelis to stop the aggression.
    Two wrongs have never made a right.

  • uncle alcoholuncle alcohol Posts: 159
    edited 11/30/99
    Isnt it just swell that Israel was so nice to stop launching missiles, to alllow in humanatarian aid to assist those poor souls slammed by missle attacks.? Then 3 hrs later went back to launching more rockets. They know exactly what they are doing. Ceasfire! Both sides are to blame. What a sad way to start 2009. I really think israel oughta know better. Perhaps they dont care., or they are looking for a little payback.
  • joolsmithjoolsmith Posts: 823
    I don't know what the Israelis are after, but there was a UN relief worker interviewed of the BBC news today and what he said about the conditions in Gaza was heartbreaking. 75% have no power or water and the humanitarian relief workers couldn't get through because of the Israelis.
    It is criminal.
    You can probably see the interview on the BBC web site.
    So why are we not invading like we did in Iraq?
    Answer that one world leaders.

  • Israel can take only so much shelling. There are two sides to every story. Peace is the ideal in the Middle East but it won't happen whilst Hamas is in charge of the Palestinians. Israel has made plenty of attempts, and it was not them who broke the ceasefire. Palestinian militants hide their leaders and their explosives in civilian houses so even targeted attacks cause immense amounts of human suffering - there is nothing Israel can do about this. Its own people are dying and living in fear daily. If Wales was shelling Manchester on a daily basis, how long would it be before England did something about it. The Israelis want peace via a two state solution - it is the Palestinians who argue that Israel should be wiped off the map. How can peace be expected to thrive when one side wants the other side not to exist any longer? The British media do not show a balance, which is sad and leads to misrepresentation and unjustified vilification of Israel.
  • joolsmithjoolsmith Posts: 823
    The UN compound was hit by shells containing white phosphorous today.
    That cannot be justified by anyone.
    The Middle East needs a political solution, not a military one.
    Both sides are wrong, and two wrongs have never made a right.

  • Firing on the UN compound was indeed a mistake, but in the heat of battle if the Palestinian forces choose the UN building as a base to fire at Israeli soldiers from, the lines become blurred. You are absolutely correct that the Middle East needs a diplomatic solution rather than a military one, but that still doesn't take into account the fact that whilst Israel has made concession upon concession, has initiated negotiation after negotiation and held to a ceasefire for 6 months, Hamas and the Palestinian people have made no such alterations of their position, have not treated talks respectfully, and have continually fired rockets into Israel. Israel believes that the only way to peace is to stop these forces firing rockets, and that is what this recent military operation has been designed to do. Yesterday (Friday 16th Jan) an important deal was signed by Israel and the US about the cessation of weapon smuggling by Hamas from Egypt. With the Egyptian border controlled, once Israel has stopped the rocket fire we could be closer to peace in the region. This operation is not a wanton excercise - it has a specific purpose that Israel believes is right for its citizens and ultimately right for the progression of peace talks.
  • uncle alcoholuncle alcohol Posts: 159
    edited 11/30/99
    First of all, a very good friend of mine is working for the Red Cross in this conflict. What does she tell me? She tells me Israel will not cease its bombing, and there actions are deplorable"We have no solution, you shall continue to live like dogs, and whoever wishes may leave, and we will see where this process leads." -( Moshe Dayan, former Israeli Minister of Defense speaking about Palestinians in the occupied territories.) pretty fuckin sick huh? ..

    Israel broke the ceasefire, not Hamas. Israel, (contrary to popular opinion}, also never left the Gaza strip and still controls taxation, the sea, air and land borders. If China had the same control over the United States, would you understand if Americans wanted to defend itself? After all, the U.S went to war with Great Britain over taxation.
    Yes,Hamas is at fault for civilian casualties as it uses "mosques, schools, private residences and even hospitals as locations to manufacture, store and launch weapons at Israel and hide its leaders." However..

    Israel cannot bomb schools and hospitals just because it believes Hamas may be hiding there. It is a direct VIOLATION of international law, and therefore constitutes a WAR CRIME.


    . Israel "Seized the West Bank and Gaza in 1967 not out of imperialistic aggression, but as a means of defending itself from its neighbors."

    Regardless of whether Israel seized the West Bank and Gaza out of imperial aggression or self-defense, acquisition of land through war is explicitly forbidden under the Geneva Conventions, and a direct violation of international law.

    "Israel has showed remarkable restraint and proportionality, evidenced by the fact that an overwhelming majority of the Palestinian casualties have not been civilians. The world should be lauding Israel for its efforts to minimize civilian casualties." BULLSHIT.!

    Israel has just bombed two U.N schools in the Gaza strip,2 media outlets and have thus far killed over 900 people, 220 or more of them children. The 'remarkable restraint and proportionality' Israel had shown is over 100-1 in terms of the Palestinian to Israeli death toll, on top of many millions of dollars in structural damage. The world does not accept this. Never will.

    . "Since the Palestinian people elected Hamas to power, they have themselves to blame for the damage done to them by their leaders." More Bullshit.

    Just because Palestinians voted for Hamas does not give Israel the right to kill them. Collective punishment is explicitly illegal under international law. Article 33 of the Fourth Geneva Convention states:

    No protected person may be punished for an offense he or she has not personally committed. Collective penalties and likewise all measures of intimidation or of terrorism are prohibited.

    A grievous crime was committed against Palestinians when their land was forcefully taken from them in 1948. They had committed no crimes against Jews, and were not consulted when their land was given away. European nations had systematically slaughtered Jews for centuries, then laid the burden on the Palestinians,( a fact that the West would rather forget). The Palestinians will never get their land back, just as Native Americans won't get theirs. But at least we can acknowledge what has happened to them, and work seriously for a lasting solution. The Palestinians are an oppressed people, and to blame them for their own predicament is simply inexcusable. Get youre shit together, Israel. UPDATE: Looks like we have a ceasefire. Unless Israel cant keep its finger off the trigger . Peace.

  • joolsmithjoolsmith Posts: 823
    I'm not an expert, just an ordinary UK citizen who can't understand a power that tries to justify killing children. That goes for both sides in this conflict.
    What I would like to know is why the rest of the world are not sending a UN force in to Palestine/Israel to enforce a peace.
    Surely there is more justification for invading Israel, a known nuclear and aggressive state, than there was for invading Iraq, who had NO nuclear weapons.
    Partitioning has never worked. It did not work in Ireland and it is not working in Palestine/Israel.
    There has to be a return to the drawing board because the "answers" of the 1940's &50's has not worked.
    There needs to be a complete Middle East rethink.
    That means that both Israel and Palestine have to be controlled by international powers, because they can't be relied on to find a political solution for themselves.
    Both sides turn to arms and that will never work.

  • When will we see peace in the Middle East? Sometimes it seems like never. Perhaps Obama's administration will be able to provide some type of assistance to both parties to stop all of the bickering. We can only hope I suppose.

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  • sunrisesunrise Posts: 120
    I don't know how this will go down in the US, but there is a huge amount of sympathy for the Palestinians and anger towards the Israelis in the UK.


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  • How can you call targeting terrorists who refuse to recognize Israel's right to exist and brainwash children to hate and become suicide bombers Nazi war crimes? The State Of Israel has tried endlessly to make peace with Palestinian leaders, but they are so corrupt and full of hatred that there has been no chance, especially under the terrorist organization, Hamas. There was only a chance with Abbas, who sadly lost power to terrorists. Until a real leader who really wants peace like Sadat and King Hossein comes to power the Palestinians will continue to live poorly and in ignorance under terrorists who live to see Israel "wiped off the face of the map," as Iranian President Ahmadinjead so nicely stated to the world.

    If you want to mention Nazis, they tried to wipe out the Jewish, Catholic, and other races but failed. Other forms of evil will fail, too, as people become more and more aware of what is REALLY happening with corrupt leaders.

    The 20+% of Muslims who live in Israel understand the situation well. They have more rights as Israeli-Arabs than they would have in any Middle Eastern country.

    Israel is a democracy with no death penalty and a recognition of all religions, as well as gay rights. GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT AND STOP THE ANTI-SEMITISM.
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